Super Tweeters

[Chris]

What's your thoughts on super tweeters?

Here is I think a nice design, omindirectional...

http://www.stoneaudio.co.uk/stoneaud...p?product=1315

[Paul Barker]

Price is a bit off puting, and the fact that at 15khz most tweeters are working fine so you don't really want it coming in that low as you'll get a peak. But what do I know about speakers. I mean say a tweeter is flat up to 20khz, you want your supoer tweeter taking over from ther don't you? Otherwise all you are doing is falsifying the frequency response.

[smithie]

hi
i have some tonigon ribbon tweeters lying around,as used in glastornburys,sextets ,sd1 etc,and was thinking of giving them ago as a super tweeter as there ment to be good for 40,000khz.
has anyone got the specs for these drivers? as that would be helpful along with any ideas regarding xovers etc!
if the super tweeters that are avaliable on the market today only start from 20,000khz up then how would you know there working?...drag a dog in i guess,might not even be working..wow what a con that would be...only in hifi land is such things possible....of course if it does add something then my theroys blown thats why im curious to give it a try...on another point how will they work if the cd player ,amps etc are bandwidth limited!
so many questions!
all the best
smithie

[NealG]

AFAIK and according to a HFW supplement, the Toingen get's to 20K and no futher.

[smithie]

Originally Posted by NealG

AFAIK and according to a HFW supplement, the Toingen get's to 20K and no futher.

hi
ive been in touch with my mate who has some townsend glastonbury speakers and which use the the tonigon ribbon tweeters that i have,and according to the spec plate on the back of the speaker they good for 20hz to 50khz,so unless anyone has a proper spec sheet for the tonigon tweeter then max townsend is also saying that this tweeter is a super tweeter,in which case maybe i can have a play with it after all and try the theory out!
all the best
smithie

Originally Posted by smithie

hi
ive been in touch with my mate who has some townsend glastonbury speakers and which use the the tonigon ribbon tweeters that i have,and according to the spec plate on the back of the speaker they good for 20hz to 50khz

Hmm,
Noel, in the June 1993 HFW DIY Supplement regarding the Tonigen he used in the KLS1, wrote:
"The (1.5uF) capacitor gives it a net flat frequency response ... and full output from 6kHz up to 20kHz exactly above which output drops like a stone."
He also mentioned:
"six ohms pure resistance" and "sensitivity of 87dB".

Five years later, in the April 1998 Supplement, the Tonigen is tested without a crossover by Noel using a sweep from 500Hz to 50kHz. The graph clearly shows a sharp dive in response above 20kHz, the quoted impedance and sensitivity differ in this later article though:
"Considerably flatter than a conventional dome tweeter, it runs smoothly from 6kHz to 20kHz ... This one delivers no less than 92.5dB sound pressure level from 2.8v input ... To achieve this Tonigen have used a low impedance of four ohms"
The corresponding impedance plot is ruler flat.

I don't know how Townshend derived their figures for the 'speaker featuring the Tonigen, but the one constant in Noel's articles is that 6kHz to 20kHz bandwidth, at 50kHz the tweeter looks to be down in output by at least 15dB (more like -25dB!)

I know that Peter used the Tonigen at Heybrook, he may know more about it?

And to get fully back on topic, did anyone attempt a reading of the link I gave earlier?
(Inaudible High-Frequency Sounds Affect Brain Activity.)

[John T]

Originally Posted by smithie

if the super tweeters that are avaliable on the market today only start from 20,000khz up then how would you know there working?...

I've heard both Tannoy and Townsend versions and in both cases, to my ears (and others to whom I've spoken on the subject), there was quite a perceptible improvement in the sound - and, the strange thing is the fact that the bass actually improved in depth and clarity! If I have a spare £1000 I'd certainly invest in a pair!

[smithie]

like ive said ive never heard any so obviously you have more insight on the subject then me.
still cant get my head around how they can improve things if the source and amp is bandwidth limited,also the same with cd material!
thats a shame about the tonigons only going to 20.000khz,was hoping for a cheap fix/play.....still i was thinking of investing in ted jordans new tweeters so maybe this is the excuse i need!
smithie

[steve s]

Originally Posted by John T

I've heard both Tannoy and Townsend versions and in both cases, to my ears (and others to whom I've spoken on the subject), there was quite a perceptible improvement in the sound - and, the strange thing is the fact that the bass actually improved in depth and clarity! If I have a spare £1000 I'd certainly invest in a pair!

ummm.... i wonder about all this.. there is no doubt good quality tweeters sound very good.. the extremes is also where it it easy to judge how good a system or just the speaker is ( or is not?)

i cannot hear above 15khz... so everything is wasted above that for me
but i assume these super tweeters are also working at below this level.. and a good tweeter is a good tweeter, those ribons at the last wadfest where very good as i recall, but then there is the problem in the mids and bass not being quite up at that level quality wise....


Improvements in bass cannot be just the tweeters influnce ... but the system could be reacting to the load or a change in load, xover or whatever..

from what i've seen just about everything can influnce something else in hifi

steve

[Clive]

Somehow our perception gets changed in strange ways. With subwoofers it's often the case that treble improves. So if the reverse happens with super-tweeters then I'm not supriesed. Can't explain it though.