A deck too far !

[andrew ivimey]

rather than post in the relevant long running threads I will start this one as there probably isn't too much mileage.

'tis a tale told by a madman, full of sound and fury, signifying .... not much.

I was a happy chap with my GyroDec, and then the goldring thread began.

I bought a 401 but the sheer enthusiasm by some of us and a lucky find of a GL78 for £21 diverted me. Also a very good direct drive deck came along and begged me to buy it. So I did.

The 401 went on the side; a known quantity, (one I had many years ago) or so I thought.

The direct drive stunned me; slam, power! The denon 103 was superb. I moved on feeling smug.

I fettled cleaned and oiled a GL78. Then I built a huge and very heavy plinth. I mounted an RB250 with Denon 103. Marvellous! not set up right? Yep, but it still sounded good; loads of bass. something wrong though.

Along came the Hadcock - SUPERB! and even though not set up exactly exactly, this was the business. Clarity and everything else, with a 103.

So on to the 401. This was going to be easy. The 401 works a treat; smooth with good reliability, **** plinth but will do for hacking around or so I thought.

I mounted the Hadcock. UUUUUUUuuuuuuuurrrrggggh! No bass,

VTA nearly right, all the other variables reasonably right, maybe not enough decoupling with ligtweight plinth but a very kindly loan of an instruction book to check what I'd done.

it sounds awful.

Right now, if someone were to knock on my door there would be a 401 going.

It has been far too easy so far, evidently. But right now it is 11/10 for the GL78 and Hadcock. 7/10 with the rb250 - and it was not at all set right.

& 4/10 for the 401 / Hadcock.

weird or what. It has to be the plinth, doesn't it ??????

I am a little put out.

[Paul Barker]

Rejoice that's one overpriced deck to sell and one underpriced one to enjoy.

[andrew ivimey]

Music to my ears with chorus and harmony to boot. That is exactly how I feel but blimey I know 401s can sound excellent ... but can I be bothered?

It is the plinth.

[david counter]

no idea what's wrong, Dave Dove has that combination and swears by it,
my only experience is that bass happens on a 36mm plinth, one of 401's best points is it's bass

[NealG]

Andrew, I have no idea.

My experiments so far are leading me to believe the RB250 in whatever guise it comes in is seriously flawed. As Paul says, rejoice in the knowledge you have purchased a little known (for now) deck at very good money and are in a fortunate position (for now) to sell it and re-coup some serious funds!

And yes it is probably the plinth....possibly...

[Paul Barker]

I've never rated the rb250 either since better arms are available second hand for less money.

I suppose if you must buy new it's good value. There is always the chance that a second hand arm has been badly worn. Fortunately that hasn't been my experience. The good thing about an rb250 is there are a whole load of people who think they are good so they sell like hot cakes.

[spikeyfaz]

I don't suppose it's the cartridge by any chance? I know you say it sounds great on your other decks but I had a 103 for a while and I never really got on with it. It just sounded woolly to my ears. I traded it for a Goldring G1042 which is now mounted on my Ittok/GL75.Loads of bass and clarity.

[andrew ivimey]

The 103 has sounded fab on my japanese drect drive turntable and arm, the hadcock on the Goldring. I am not sure you could get much more different from teh long, reasonably high mass JVC arm and teh delicate unipivot Hadcock, so on the whole, nah, it ain't the cartridge.

[andrew ivimey]

After an hour or so of careful checking and getting it right according to HiFiNews test record, things sound hugely better. I am recovering from initial shock. I was getting blase about the apparent ease I had had in getting turntables to sound marvellous.

The Hadcock and 401 now sounds very respectable with good frequency extremes. Now, perhaps the 103 is the weak part. The 401 plinth is okay for experiments but I need to get cutting, filing, staining, bleeding etc again. I am sure this woudl pay very high dividends. But I can't be bothered.

So far then I have been stunned by the JVC's sheer slam and animal magnetism. The Goldie is stunning and has my vote simply because it does!

So a day of typing and more than a half an ear towards the 401 setup playing esentially classical stuff. Then, probably back to the Goldie.

Hadcock's are great arms. I have never even seen a Moerch or other exotic esoterica.

[IslandPink]

Andrew,
Have you got any extra mass on the headshell with the 103 ?
They can sound quite limited with many arms unless you put at least 5g of extra mass ( eg. a lead shim ) between the cart and headshell , or above the headshell, and , or cousre, balance it up again . The bass gets MUCH better by the way .

Also, I found the other day that mine sounds better ( and the diamond looks more correct in the groove ) with about 2.25g instead of 2.5g .

I think you need to perservere with both the Denon and the 401 , more than many other bits of equipment - there's lots to learn .

Just wish I could get my supply box for the 401 working - trying to de-bug the LM3886 now - not sure what to do !

Mark