Another set of secondhand speakers

[Black Stuart]

I'm almost certainly ahead of my own personal curve thinking about speakers aka first the room to be used and then think about the speakers to be used in it.

Over 20 years ago I popped for a s/hand set of Heybrook Sextet Mk 1V's. Bought them from a lovely man in Kent who was forced to get rid of them by his so righteous Christian dragon, apparently they 'interfered' with her church coffee mornings. Personally I would have got rid of the dragon first without a second thought, agreed it would have been the expensive option but so satisfying.

The Heybrooks are a lovely speaker and certainly the best effort Peter Comeaux did at Heybrooks. The Toningen ribbon tweeter is great and the cabinet's dimensions have been copied by many but the bass goes only so far. I'm about to rip out a few of the x/over components for much better ones - Mills r's and some K73-16 caps and utilise what I have learned about analogue signal cables to change the internal wiring as well but still the itch is there to acquire speakers that really do bass. I don't mean OTT bass but what is no the LP or hard disc.

Even when I have popped for a 'new' s/hand set the last thing I will change will be the UBYTE 2 speaker cables. Eventually they will be swapped for a set of' Heaviside' type cables.

I accept the argument that multiple small woofers can emulate 12"/15"/18" jobbies I don't have the will anymore to use the Grand Heil AMTs that Andrew Ivimey sold me to make a set of OBs (sad but true).

It's years since I saw the real benefit of having a neutral system - the old time warm/soft Quad/Radford et al sound is nothing for me but neither is s/s only.

I use hybrid power/h/amps that use a single driver/2 output tube pre-amp section for both with mosfet o/put. This may/can be changed for class D o/put if the speakers demand lots of power but I can't imagine ever moving away from valve pre-amp - 6F8G Tung Sol RP driver/output Russian 1578.

I've looked at Kef but the Canadian Paradigm appeal, especially the Reference Studio 100 v2/v3. I'm not a snob Emotiva T1 could be the answer. I am prepared to shell out up to £2K used - all suggestions will be received with an open mind

[Richard]

Hi Stuart, what room dimensions, construction and furnishings? What amp power?

[Black Stuart]

Richard,
should be moving to another rented house - with a hard Brexit possible, very glad we havn't bought here, only the very rich could afford PHI (private health insurance) if that happens.

However we are prepared to take a punt and buy a piece of land with a positive CU. If the worst happens we can sell it, as I would never buy unless all the fundamentals were good. If WD members like I can create a thread with factual info about buying/building a house in France.Do not trust anything you see on British websites or English language papers, at best it's b/s but more likely total lies. In Spain only idiots buy - you rent.

If the worst happens, I am going to enquire on Monday about a plot in Dumfries and Galloway that is interesting (I have viewed using Google Maps). It has an existing building, if I can demolish and build from new, we will buy. It has a 'real world' price - vamos a ver.

So, the house we are going to see next week has an irregular 23 sq. m lounge. As it was built in the 1950s, I can be sure the internal walls use 3 inch hollow clay blocks with a plaster finish. This means if you turn the volume up the hard reflective finish means a harsh ringing occurs. Modern French houses have single plasterboard walls which suck all the life and bass out of music. The walls will have kelims and antique Flemish table carpets hung. The floor is either wooden or a laminate over concrete.

I already have a design for a house that has changed dramatically to reflect age and possible mobility problems and will include a personal room that will be around 20 sq. m so dimension wise I can buy now for the future. Needless to say none of the negatives of classic French building products will apply.

Once again I find Europe as a whole is a rip-off compared to the USA/Taiwan/Hong Kong/China. I looked up all the reviews on the Paradigm/Emotiva T1/T2 towers very positive, speaker recs. along these lines I would welcome.

The ribbon tweeters of the Emotivas are well liked and having Heybrook Sextets I can understand why. Sadly the price differential between the USA and Europe illustrates my point very well - 80% plus difference in price. There are available second hand some Paradigms Reference studio 100s. I should have added I'm only interested in floor standers.

[Black Stuart]

Been doing a lot of research these last few days and a Tawainese maker - Usher appears to be very good. They 'copy' Scanspeak units and the cabinets and fittings are top notch. The CP, N and Dancer models have very good reputations. Leaning more to the CP models. The later d'appolito models appear to be more 'forward', the CP models more natural.

However most of the speakers I've considered need more powerful amps to give of their best than my hybrid amp delivers. It uses 4 x Toshiba mosfets as output each rated @ 125W output which only draw a max. of 12.5 W each - how easy would it be to double this?

The pre-amp section uses a combo of 3 tubes that I love the sound of - a 6F8G tung Sol RP and 2 x Russian 1578 coupled with the mosfet output - I really want to keep this set-up, it was end game when I first heard it.

[Richard]

Hi Stuart, yes John Caswell and I had a listen to the Ushers a few years ago at Bristol and agreed the big ones were one of the best at the show. Not cheap though. I went shopping for speakers 2 years ago and ended up with Tannoy XT8F against several well known models in the £1-2k region. Very pleased with them still today so perhaps get a listen. Your longest room dimension will dictate the lowest clean frequency and there are plenty of room calculators on the web to give you an idea of what response to aim for.

[Black Stuart]

Richard,
as i remember you have a large listening room as we had in Hove, great for music. Since we left the UK many years ago we have never had anything like the same kind of environment to listen to music in.

The new house at least will give me a 'personal room' but way smaller than I would like @ 14 sq.m. With a little luck it will only be for about 2 years, so being positive maybe I shall buy for a compromised sound now that will suit in the future.

I note that the Revolution series have a slighty bright top-end, can you confirm this. It appears the Ushers are sweet in comparison with a silk dome tweeter.

I don't know if I can get my hybrid amp output section changed to double o/put, the mosfets aren't the problem. To this end I have been looking at alternatives and there is a modern version of the Quad 405 that looks interesting @ £499. I'm wondering if I can just use the pre-amp part of the Bada, maybe a I need to ask this question on diyaudio.

There are 2 Ushers - NOS that are available for reasonable money. Maybe a trip back to the island to hear this 405C which is possible at Yapton not far from Hove. The Ushers are in East Anglia.There are always plusses and minusses, living in the countryside of a big country is great but with Toulouse 250K is the round trip and other big cities are even further - not easy.

[Richard]

Hi Stuart,

The Tannoys sound "just right" to me and a good step forward of other commercial speakers I've had. I chose them in a shop with a smaller listening room and my thoughts didn't change when I got them home. That said, we have carpets and curtains and a neutral amp (as did the shop) but perhaps some reviewers have a brighter more reflective room or a sparkier amp. Try and get a listen.

They are 91dB 8R and don't need a lot of power for high volumes. You don't mention your amp power. The 405 is very good but I don't know about a modded 405. I had one for 12 years when they first came out (70's) and have one now along with 303, 306 and 606. The 405 has the most open and neutral mid band and is so easy to listen to but the 306 and 606 have greater bandwidth and depth imho. I swap them around from time to time and it always comes back to that.

[Black Stuart]

As so often Richard a good post to chew over.

The Bada PH 32 is rated @ 50W per channel but i think it's clipping when the volume is turned up. I wish the Quad 405s had had a mention in the early days of WAD or I had spent more time on other audio sites. The initial fault with earthing has been identified for a long time. The Peter Baldwin version of the Quad 405 gets good reviews. He does the logical thing to put the PSU in it's own box, thereby eliminating the hum problems. My Talk Audio MC3 phono stage does the same thing.

If I can just use the Bada PH32's pre-amp section married to the Quad 405 clone I would be as happy as Larry. I shall have to try diyaudio as I'm not sure that anyone on this forum could help. The sound of the driver Tung Sol 6F8G and Russian 1578 o/put tubes is truly end game.

[Richard]

I'd get the Bada checked though first Stuart as 50W would be plenty with circa 90dB speakers.

Looking at a pic of the insides someone should be able to fit pre-out and power-in RCAs on the back but check the pre topology as it may need to see a high impedance (>100K) and the likes of all Quad ss amps are 20K

[bob orbell]

Stuart, you mention hum from the Quad 405, I have two that have not been used for a long time, I keep them because I like them, I powered one up yesterday and guess what, no hum at all, absolutely nowt. BOB