Paypal need to be shut down totally!!

[Ianm2]

I have started this thread as a separate one to inform what has happened.

Re. the computer monitor I sold around a year ago.

I sent the monitor, the day it was despatched, the payment was reversed.

I phoned the courier but it had already been delivered.

The police treated it a civil matter.

Until is was found this man had reportedly done £38,000 of fraud in a similar manner.

It was found out the person used a few identities with which to ply his foul trade.

Upon which, my local police transferred it to the local police where the criminal was.

After countless months I have just had a call from the CID where the crime occurred.

They have intimated the credit card was not stolen or a forged identity, that bit it rather confused, but somthing to the effect that the man had sold items which never turned up, and possibly didn't exist.

So, paypal and ebay it transpires froze his assets, and did an investigation of their own. Rather grandiose it does sound, perhaps making the need for the police redundant.

And you cannot find out the stage, the status of their enquiry, you cannot phone them and talk to a warming, kindly human voice....

So paypal have actually taken cash in my account, to credit people who have been defrauded.

They have taken my money, and have said I am not protected for a transaction as of the buyers status, however, it is not him I need protection from, paypal have taken my money, not a bank, not a stolen credit card, and paypal have said, sorry, not qualified for protection.

Read that again, paypal defrauded my money in my account to compensate other victims of fraud their system has allowed.

The CPS is currently viewing this still as a civil dispute, whilst I have had monies taken from my account without my permission or consent, and my goods deprived permenantly from me.

Is this civil?

Should the police fail to act, after the misguided advice of the CPS, I shall seek to be taking up a private prosecution against paypal, I intend to make it very public, I am outraged to the extreme, Iit is my wish to destroy them in their entirity. Sadly, I believe they are too big for that. They can and must not get away with their foul way of operation. If they do, then the world will be a worse place for it.

This is the reason I am most disturbed about computers, about the companies, they are not contactable, they do not even work with the police except when they must, they also limit the information they divulge to us and them, you do not know if its the truth, you cannot talk to someone who can make a decision. This is what disturbs me, and should disturb everyone in this land.

First they came for the jew and I did not speak out..

Finally they came for me, and there was no-one left to speak out for me.

Rise up, before the time is too late. It is happening as we speak

[Greg.]

Hi Ian,

You do seem to be a continual victim of the short comings of ebay and paypal. I don't trade very often (about 31 times in total buying and selling) yet I've generally not encountered the problems you seem to get. Maybe I've been lucky. I've had one problem that got sorted with the help of ebay/paypal. What's going on?

Best wishes,

Greg

[Darren D]

Hi Greg,

I have to agree with Ian I'm afraid, My exp with Ebay and Paypal are disheartening. I continually get non payers and the number of times I've been charged back is mounting.
These days some buyers win your item, pay for it and them make a claim for non receipt a few days later.

Having proof of delivery will not help, Paypal simply just refund them from your account.

I stopped accepting Paypal for a while, but my sales dropped dramatically and I ended selling items for silly money or not at all. Ebay still wanted their cut though.

There may come a time that I pull off from Ebay altogether as a seller, too much goes astray and I end up out of pocket.

I have been thinking of setting up a "for sale" page on my site, just for the better stuff. I don't really care how long it takes to sell, I'm just getting fed up of being ripped off and it's always the good/expensive stuff.

[NealG]

Darren, have thought about alternatives, something like:

http://www.995merchantaccounts.com/

[Ianm2]

yes just to put darren in perspective, ebay say you have 28 days to get an item to someone.

they can put in a paypal claim 1 minute after the auction finished, or even 1 second.

and like darren says, unless you work hard and give irrefutable proof and evidence in the way only they will accept, then the case will go to the complainant, and they get your item, and your money.

and yes they take their cut indeed.

listing fees,

comission fees

reserve fees, if you don't use paypal and are scared of losing too much

then paypal fees that you cannot charge for.

postal fees, are they going to say you now have to post for free?

and if you want to charge sufficient for a trackable service, taht puts people off and you lose cash.

( I shipped this via a courier, I had a tracking no. yet, I still didn't qualify for protection)

ebay is not viable anymore, I am afriad.

its actually good fortune I have found this out, as at least I expect things to go wrong in the worst way now, and am not naive and innocent, however, the morals of some of the people there make me rather uneasy to say the least.

(I now 'know' evil that they do, to talk in biblical language, greg used to be born again !!, but am rather shocked at what debase behaviour these people indulge in as granted, I have to 'learn' from others to become aware of that behaviour, and I am rather disturbed by it.)

and then the police treat it as civil.

WEll it ain't very civil, and who is going to sue? not many, intimidating, difficult, unknown, and troublesome, perhaps costly.

so, now if you are of the particular type, you can buy an item on credit card, paypal, receive it, if it was posted in such a way as not to have a tracking no., ie. first class, or std. parcels, even if signed for I believe, unless you have a tracking number, you can say, never recieved, and either complain to paypal, or do a credit card charge back.

this for any value of item.

it wan'st this person I actually had a problem with, he is a crook for sure, but paypal have stolen money from my account to compensate people he defrauded, and now say I am not protected on that transaction, tough.

would you believe that?

never, ever, ever, again, anyone who now uses paypal after this, and you really don't know what they can do, I have read some of the small print, and other horror stories, there are myriad. They even do things not listed in their print, and when you complain, simply say 'tough'.

And what to do, sue? has one the time, the inclination?

Again, can't walk into a shop to make trouble.

And all the info is hard to find, splashed all over the place, its deliberate, I am sure of it, they make myriad of small print, in inaccessible language, over 5 layers of screens with links here and there, always not giving the full information,the contradidction and deliberate misinforing with regard to protection is a sham, its fortunate I discovered how veiled, layered and confusing, it really was. that tells me in one hit how they work

it is deliberate, lots of companies use those tactics, either they are illiterate idiots or intending to confuse obfuscate and stop you from knowing the truth, which, after all these things happening, I am inclined to believe.

they hold your cash for 180 days, and don't give you interest, just dip into your money when they feel like, and you cannot contact them, cannont talk to someone, even if you do, they cannot do anything, and jsut say tough, this isn't isolated, this is happening all over, all the time, money going missing on multiple occasions, waiting to get it back months without interest.

these companies that you cannont talk to, they could just shut down, and take all the cash, and the police may never find them.

Its an accident waiting to happen

just take my word for it, don't ever use them again. anyone who does is asking for troulbe. forewarned

[James D]

I use PayPal without any problems BUT I do not and will not give them my bank account details... I only allow them to charge my credit card on a per transaction basis...

This limits me to £500 per month for purchases and I don't sell through ebay directly but it keeps me safe.

James

[John Caswell]

Hi all,
As PayPal is a financial company it is regulated in the UK by the Financial Services Authority, so maybe that might be a place to complain.
I must admit I have not had any problems paying suppliers with PayPal, it all seems to go smoothly and I have always got the goods.
Time will tell!

John aka Dr john

[John T]

I too have had no problems buying with Paypal. However, I was under the impression that Ian and Darren were reporting trouble with Paypal when selling items....

[pre65]

Hi-for me as a buyer paypal is a boon and ensures i get things quickly BUT when i sell i am loath to offer paypal because i have heard SO MANY bad reports.

My new employer uses e-bay to sell items and he has told me of several bad experiences similar to Ianm2.

I agree that buyers feel safer with protection mechanisms in force but the way paypal (an e-bay company ?) operate is nothing short of criminal.(IMO)

Philip

[Darren D]

Originally Posted by John T

I too have had no problems buying with Paypal. However, I was under the impression that Ian and Darren were reporting trouble with Paypal when selling items....

That's right, buying with Paypal is fine as far as Paypal is concerned,

Selling is a different matter entirely.